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Surpass
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john kanca



Joined: 14 May 2005
Posts: 6345

PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 1:46 pm    Post subject: Surpass Reply with quote

Surpass is a new adhesive soon available from Apex. In contrast to Simplicity, t will consist of three bottles. It is analogous to bonding systems such as Optibond Fl, All Bond 2 and Scotchbond Multi-Purpose.

There is a separate conditioner, primer and bonding resin. Surpass will differ from the above systems in that it is a "no-rinse" or "self-etch" system. It is considerably quicker to apply than the above systems, can be made much thinner than the above systems, and absolutely anything can be stuck to it.

It is about as easy as it gets to apply. Surpass 1 is applied in the same manner as Simplicity 1, applied to the cavity and agitated for about 10 seconds. Just as with Simplicity 1, Surpass 1 is not dried. Then three brushfuls of Surpass 2 are applied and the cavity is dried thoroughly for ten seconds. Then a coat of Surpass 3 is applied, thinned and light-activated for ten seconds. There is no interpreting anything. There is no rinsing of etchant, no splashing of etchant about the mouth, no guessing at how wet the dentin should be. No catalysts are needed for self-cure materials. Surpass can be made as thin as anyone desires.

Test have been run at Tufts and Ultradent, in addition to here in my office. At Tufts Dr. Kugel and I averaged 53 mPa at two hours on dentin. We saw 35 mPa with Core Paste in 30 minutes.

At Ultradent we averaged nearly 60 mPa on dentin at less than one hour. We obtained about 40 mPa immediate bond strength to enamel. Neil ran a set of samples in which I asked him to thin Surpass 3 as much as he could. The result was over 50 mPa within 30 minutes.

Surpass is not intended to be a replacement for Simplicity. There are people here on these boards who have told me that they will not part with a two bottle system, and I understand that. Yet there are many, many clinicians who still use the so-called 4th generation materials, which are often described as "gold standard." It is my intention that Surpass be viewed as the "Gold Standard" for self-etching adhesives, and I hope those who still use the 4th generation materials will find that Surpass is what they have been waiting for in their next bonding system.

Cool
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cool kid



Joined: 12 May 2005
Posts: 818
Location: chicago

PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 2:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I love my sim, but I'm sure I'll order 1 to try. Will you be doing a video for this also?
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Rich (cool kid) Rosenblatt
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john kanca



Joined: 14 May 2005
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 2:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cool kid wrote:
I love my sim, but I'm sure I'll order 1 to try. Will you be doing a video for this also?


I will indeed be doing a video for Surpass. Cool
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k1000



Joined: 12 May 2006
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Location: St-Eustache

PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 3:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What are the advantages of surpass compared to simplicity? Are the bond strengths higher? Any other advantages?
Does Simplicity have any advantages over Surpass aside from being a 2 bottle system? I am sure to try Surpass when it comes out Very Happy

Thanks for the info Smile
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john kanca



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PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 4:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The bond strength numbers are higher. I had every intention of making something with sky-high bond strengths. When one's friends and fellow researchers look at the numbers and say "Was that really a 60?" it makes you feel pretty good.

It is less technique sensitive than Simplicity and there's a lot of leeway as long as one does not dry Surpass 1. We tried throwing in several monkey wrenches and it took them all famously. You canot overdry Surpass 2, you can underdry it and it still works great, you cannot make Surpass 3 too thin either.

Neil and I both were kind of blown away by the 50's in spite of the adhesive being about 10 microns thin. Cool
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k1000



Joined: 12 May 2006
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 5:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Great! Thanks for the info!

Can't wait to give it a try. Very Happy
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cool kid



Joined: 12 May 2005
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Location: chicago

PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 5:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is it officially out? I love sim, but Gary (the guy I work with) sometimes feels it is technique sensitive. He may love this stuff.
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john kanca



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PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 6:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It is not officially available just yet. I wanted all of our crew here to have first contact.
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Mark J Fleming DDS



Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 736
Location: Sarasota, FL

PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 7:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

john kanca wrote:
It is not officially available just yet. I wanted all of our crew here to have first contact.


When will Scott let us have the material? I guess I have more lecture material!!!!!!!! Wink Cool
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satchdds



Joined: 10 Jun 2005
Posts: 210
Location: niagara falls, n.y.

PostPosted: Wed Jun 21, 2006 3:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sounds good when can I try it ?
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DrDan



Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 160
Location: Longwood, FL

PostPosted: Wed Jun 21, 2006 7:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

John,
Please share some reports about Surpass from your favorite Cajun beta tester.....
Has Bruce shared any opinions of it with you yet?

Dan Smile
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john kanca



Joined: 14 May 2005
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 21, 2006 8:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bruce has used it and has some very nice things to say about it. Cool
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Pcus



Joined: 17 May 2005
Posts: 434
Location: toronto

PostPosted: Thu Jun 22, 2006 11:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Why not have everyone send in their thoughts with regard to different clinical situations when they would require a stronger bonding agent. I think alot of us may assume a stronger bonding agent may be benificial in all situations..but I am not so sure..

For example, I have come accross many differnt types of abfraction lesions. Some are very deep, some rough some smooth and sclerotic. and so on. There have been situations where some have failed, and I know it is occlusally realated, but I am hesitant on adjusting occlusion..Would a stronger bonding agent be beneficial in this situation, when we are dealing with flexural forces, or detrimental??? I have been told in these types of situations to keep the bonding agent a little thicker to allow for a little more flexeral leeway..

I am very excited with this new surpass and will most likely switch over immediately, even though I am quiet comfortable using the Simp System.

Is is just me or does everyone want to get the highest bonds strengths possible? I am just curious if we really need them in all situations..So this is why I would be interested in everyones comments on this issue.

As I am thinking here is another situation...What about cracks, in the enamel and the root. Could a stronger bonding agent seal a small crack, in the root, and avoid the extraction of a tooth? You know the ones you can see on an exploratory surgery (I have a periodontis that works in my office) Would it not be cool to just seal them up

..Or with those cracked cups, could they be bonded together and avoid full coverage??

Put your thinking caps on boys...this could be an interesting discussion.

Is there any way we could get spell check on this forum, or is it here and I don't how to use it??
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john kanca



Joined: 14 May 2005
Posts: 6345

PostPosted: Fri Jun 23, 2006 7:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This topic ought to go elsewhere- in the general discussion section- if you don't mind I'd like to keep this thread on Surpass.
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john kanca



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PostPosted: Fri Jun 23, 2006 7:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have given "Paul's question" a place under the general discussion section. Cool
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