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Bonding PFM crowns
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cool kid



Joined: 12 May 2005
Posts: 818
Location: chicago

PostPosted: Sun May 14, 2006 4:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm going to do that right now. I have to tell my assistant on monday that we have been doing it backwards
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Rich (cool kid) Rosenblatt
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Mark J Fleming DDS



Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 736
Location: Sarasota, FL

PostPosted: Sun May 14, 2006 5:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cool kid wrote:
I'm going to do that right now. I have to tell my assistant on monday that we have been doing it backwards


Nah. Unless she reads this on this web site, you can tell her John changed the instructions!!!!!!!!!!!!! Wink Laughing Cool
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Howardmg



Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 455
Location: Bethlehem, PA.

PostPosted: Sun May 14, 2006 5:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

John-
I just checked out all the videos again and on the post and core video, you are curing the Sim 2 and then injecting the Anchor into the post holes. Since in the deepest depth of the holes, you can't count on the light, but rather you are counting on the self cure component of Anchor, shouldn't a uncured layer of Sim 2 have been used prior to injecting the Anchor?
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Howard M. Goldstein DMD.
Bethlehem. PA.
www.exceldentalcare.com
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Howardmg



Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 455
Location: Bethlehem, PA.

PostPosted: Sun May 14, 2006 5:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I mean an uncured layer of Sim 2 over a cured layer of Sim 2...
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Howard M. Goldstein DMD.
Bethlehem. PA.
www.exceldentalcare.com
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john kanca



Joined: 14 May 2005
Posts: 6342

PostPosted: Sun May 14, 2006 5:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Didn't I place a small amount of it and zap that before I placed the rest?
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Howardmg



Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 455
Location: Bethlehem, PA.

PostPosted: Sun May 14, 2006 7:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes you did.
But what about the Anchor down the post hole where the light does not reach? That part is curing by the self cure mechanism, right?
Shouldn't that part be curing against wet Sim 2 as opposed to cured Sim 2? Question

You can take an extracted tooth and do exactly what I do in the video, then cut it apart immediately and see for yourself if there is any soft composite. Wink
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Howard M. Goldstein DMD.
Bethlehem. PA.
www.exceldentalcare.com
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john kanca



Joined: 14 May 2005
Posts: 6342

PostPosted: Sun May 14, 2006 8:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

OK OK OK

I'll do another sticky post on this! Shocked
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john kanca



Joined: 14 May 2005
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PostPosted: Sun May 14, 2006 9:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bonding metal crowns:

Tooth:

Apply Simplicity and light-activate as usual. Then apply a coat of Sim 2, dry but DO NOT light-activate.

Crown:


Sandblast, rinse, dry. Apply one coat of Sim 2 and light-activate.


Insert resin cement and seat.
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Howardmg



Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 455
Location: Bethlehem, PA.

PostPosted: Sun May 14, 2006 10:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

John-
I hate to be this annoying but I want to make sure that I understand fully and I am obviously confused. A couple of posts above you told Rich and Flem that you only put the uncured layer on the tooth, not on the interior of the Cerec.

Rich said "When I cement my cerec crowns in, I prep my crown with interface, then sim 2 thinned and cured, then another thinned layer of sim 2 uncured. I have been doing this for a long time now. Does this mean that I've doing it wrong?"

Flem said "After putting a layer of Simplicity on both the tooth and restoration, I've been placing an uncured layer on both the toothand restoration. Am I reading this as the uncured layer on the restoration is not necessary?"

Your reply was "The additional unactivated layer of Sim 2 goes on the tooth."

Yet on the Cerec sticky it says "Apply a coat of Simplicity 2 to the internal surface over the Interface, dry it thoroughly and light-cure for 10 seconds.
- If you plan to use a dual-cure or self-cure resin cement, plus another coat of Simplicity 2 to the internal surface, dry but DO NOT light-cure."

I knew that I saw it somewhere that the inside of Cerecs (and I assume crowns also) needed the extra layer of uncured Sim 2.

HELP!!!!!!!!!!!
I'm lost and confused?????? Embarassed
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Howard M. Goldstein DMD.
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www.exceldentalcare.com
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john kanca



Joined: 14 May 2005
Posts: 6342

PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2006 6:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You are not in any jeopardy no matter which of these techniques you used. Since I posted that particular sticky I looked carefully at the inner surfaces of the restorations and I found that Core Paste (which is what I use for a standard self-cure material during tests) stuck great to surfaces following the application of Interface/Sim 2 for ceramic and sandblasting/Sim 2 for metal. The additional coat of Sim 2 became unnecessary, but it would never be a problem.

To be honest, I was surprised at this finding.
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Mark J Fleming DDS



Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 736
Location: Sarasota, FL

PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2006 6:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Glad to have that straightened out!!! Surprised Cool
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Howardmg



Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 455
Location: Bethlehem, PA.

PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2006 7:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks John...
For a while there I thought that I was going crazy...
Actually I mean crazier... Shocked
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Howard M. Goldstein DMD.
Bethlehem. PA.
www.exceldentalcare.com
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dsg_c1



Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 352
Location: mill creek, wa

PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2006 7:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

are we calling each other crazy or just ignorant? i could be called both!

i for one have been placing a layer of uncured on the restoration as well - that will change very quickly!!!!

thanks jk,
d
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darren greenhalgh dds
15130 main st suite 210
mill creek, wa. 98012
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425.357.6400

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drjth



Joined: 17 May 2005
Posts: 48
Location: Calgary, Alberta, Canada

PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2006 11:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Looks like I'll be saving myself some Sim2 as I have been following the original instructions as well. Thanks for clearing it up! Very Happy
cheers,
jeff
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Discovery Dental Centre
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john kanca



Joined: 14 May 2005
Posts: 6342

PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2006 11:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

john kanca wrote:
Bonding metal crowns:

Tooth:

Apply Simplicity and light-activate as usual. Then apply a coat of Sim 2, dry but DO NOT light-activate.

Crown:


Sandblast, rinse, dry. Apply one coat of Sim 2 and light-activate.


Insert resin cement and seat.



Be certain you read this properly. Exclamation
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